Thoughts, suggestions and ideas

[Pegasus]

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Suggestions / Thoughts!

Thoughts, suggestions and ideas here! If you see something and think "Hey, this would be cool" or "wow - has anyone thought of this!?" plonk it here! Thanks!

[Doran]

In this thread I pointed out that using the proposed method of conversion would put my PC into the Average wealth tier which wouldn't make any sense at all.

I came up with an alternative for converting PCs to the new system which would work better in my opinion:

First of all, take a look at the Job Threads, Professions, and Wages Guide.

At the bottom it says the following:

0gn – 4gn per day = Beggar x N/A
5gn – 10gn per day = Poor x .05
11gn – 30gn per day = Commoner x .10
31 – 50gn per day = Luxury x .15
51gn+ per day = Aristocracy x .20

A modified version of this that involves adding all of a PC's wages could be used to determine their wealth tier.

Let's say a PC makes 6 gn/trial with their first job, and 7 gn/trial with their second job. 13 gn/trial would mean Common -> Average tier.

Doran currently makes 31 gn/trial as an alchemist and 21 gn/trial as a professor -> 52 gn/trial -> Aristocracy -> somewhere between Wealthy and Rich

The following formula could then be used to determine a PC's wealth points:

Current Daily Wage +( Current Ledger Total/1000) + (Value of Property Owned /1000)= current wealth points.

This would lead to PCs at Rich only having a few dozen wealth points rather than 151+, for example, but that shouldn't be too much of an issue.

[Pegasus]

Doran - I think.. I *think* this is what I was thinking. But maths and me really don't work. Would you be prepared to do that calculation, your way, with maybe a half dozen PCs (or more) and have a look see if it works?

[Kyreen]

This may be more math than you want to deal with, but I "think" I have an easyish method of assigning approximate tiers to the price list, based on existing wage tiers and prices.

If new tiers are:
Absolute Poverty (0 - 5)
Destitute (6 -14)
Poor (15 - 30)
Struggling (31 -50)
Average (51 - 75)
Comfortable (76 - 100)
Wealthy (101 - 120)
Very Wealthy (121 -150)
Rich (151 -200)
Filthy Rich (201+)

And old wage tiers are:
0gn – 4gn per day = Beggar x N/A
5gn – 10gn per day = Poor x .05
11gn – 30gn per day = Commoner x .10
31 – 50gn per day = Luxury x .15
51gn+ per day = Aristocracy x .20

Then splitting the old tiers at the halfway point becomes:

Absolute Poverty (0-2 gn)
Destitute (3-4 gn)
Poor (5-7 gn)
Struggling (8-10 gn)
Average (11-20 gn)
Comfortable (21-30 gn)
Wealthy (31-40 gn)
Very Wealthy (41-50 gn)
Rich (51-75 gn?)
Filthy Rich (76+ gn)

Then all you would need to do is go through the existing list and ask, "Is the base price for this item within the range of a day's wage"? Yes/No. If Yes, then it falls in that tier, if No, then it falls in a higher/lower tier.

If you wanted to add more math, you could say 1x wage for everyday stuff (eg. food, clothes), 2x wage for tools, inc armour and weapons, and 3x wage for animals.

Fabric multipliers virtually sort themselves: N/a for Absolute Poverty, 0.x for Destitute, 1.x for Poor, 2.x for Struggling and so on.

[Doran]

Doran currently makes a total of 52 gn a trial (21 gn as a professor and 31 as an alchemist which should increase to 25 and 35 respectively at the end of the cycle). That would put him in the Rich tier, if we decide to go with the tiers Kyreen proposed which is approximately the lifestyle I imagine him having.

Devin currently makes a total of 24 gn a trial (11 gn as a bard and 13 gn as a con man) which would put him into the Comfortable tier. That also seems about right to me.

Victor currently makes 23 gn as a researcher, and the wage for his second job that I’ve neglected so far (mercenary, I think) should amount to approximately 8 gn which means that he’s in the Wealthy tier which also seems about right, perhaps even a bit better than I imagined.

As far as Wealth Points are concerned, according to the formula you proposed, Pegasus, Doran would have approximately 64 wealth points.

Vega (who is not my PC, by the way) has no job, and thus she would be in the Absolute Poverty tier with approximately one wealth point. What do you think about that, Pegasus? Does that seem right to you or do we need to make adjustments for PCs that don’t (regularly) write job threads?

I haven’t done any other PCs yet because I don’t know how much exactly they make.

I don’t know how many wealth points new PCs will start with, but if current PCs have fewer wealth points than that, could they perhaps be given an 10 wealth points if they want to (for example, if new PCs start with 10 wealth points) so that they aren’t at a disadvantage compared to new players as far as being able to afford stuff is concerned?

[Pegasus]

Oh that's great, Doran and Kyreen! That sounds like it works. Ok. Thank you, Kyreen!!!

So that brings up a good point, there. Wilderness PCs. Both Vega and Arlo have had jobs - so we could work it out on those wages. But some wilderness pcs never do. I'd put Vega's Wealth Tier at Poor - which works just fine for both her and Arlo. They own a Schooner - which cost 10K, but yeah.

So if we have the following conversion for current wage:

Absolute Poverty (0-2 gn)
Destitute (3-4 gn)
Poor (5-7 gn)
Struggling (8-10 gn)
Average (11-20 gn)
Comfortable (21-30 gn)
Wealthy (31-40 gn)
Very Wealthy (41-50 gn)
Rich (51-75 gn?)
Filthy Rich (76+ gn)

So, Faith's wage is 48gn for her business and 25gn for her professor job. This would put her in the Rich category - which would be right if she didn't give half her money away. But omg, Kyreen that seems to work! Thank you SO much.

So - what I'd like to do is for a few people to work out their wages on this.

Then - there is the question of - what to do about existing PCs with no jobs. I wonder if we do a blanket "Wilderness PCs are at "Struggling" wealth tier - unless they've got an argument why / not in which case we look case by case?"

Also- Wealth Tiers are here = I'm going to try and finish writing them today. Any input very welcome!!

Thanks again!

[Kyreen]

Then - there is the question of - what to do about existing PCs with no jobs. I wonder if we do a blanket "Wilderness PCs are at "Struggling" wealth tier - unless they've got an argument why / not in which case we look case by case?"

Offer them a conversion of base rate + skill bonus? 2gn base + 0/2/3/4/5 bonus, with up to two jobs, gives a range of 2 (Absolute Poverty) to 14 (Average), perhaps?

Kyreen will have a wage of 11-12 gn from baker by the end of the cycle, which puts her in Average, which is about right.

[Pegasus]

Yeah, I have to say Kyreen - thank you - that seems to work REALLY well.

Also - I've put up a suggested list of The Wealth Tiers - it includes stuff on NPCs and WIlderness PCs which is a change. Nothing's set in stone - staff are still looking at it etc. But feedback would be great!

[Lei'lira]

I don't know if it would help, but if someone wants to try this with Lei'lira, I'd love to see where she would fall into this. Math is really not my strong point, so I haven't tried it myself yet. She made 40 GN per trial in her last job thread (Saun 718), so when this starts in Cylus, she would be making 46 GN per trial. She has very little money at the moment (472 GN, 2 SN) because she just bought a large farm house in Rharne. She paid 23,181 GN for her farm, but that included 15 acres of land, the house itself (8700sqft), stabling for 55 horses, assorted farm buildings, fencing, and furniture. Travel fees for herself, her family, and her animals were included in that price, so I don't know how much of that total was for the travel fees. If valuable animals like horses also come into play, well...she has a lot of those, too.

Looking at Kyreen's suggestion, Lei'lira's wage places her in the very wealthy category. I remember seeing that property value will add to the overall wealth a PC has, but I don't know how much impact it will have.

[Pegasus]

I don't know if it would help, but if someone wants to try this with Lei'lira, I'd love to see where she would fall into this. Math is really not my strong point, so I haven't tried it myself yet. She made 40 GN per trial in her last job thread (Saun 718), so when this starts in Cylus, she would be making 46 GN per trial. She has very little money at the moment (472 GN, 2 SN) because she just bought a large farm house in Rharne. She paid 23,181 GN for her farm, but that included 15 acres of land, the house itself (8700sqft), stabling for 55 horses, assorted farm buildings, fencing, and furniture. Travel fees for herself, her family, and her animals were included in that price, so I don't know how much of that total was for the travel fees. If valuable animals like horses also come into play, well...she has a lot of those, too.

Looking at Kyreen's suggestion, Lei'lira's wage places her in the very wealthy category. I remember seeing that property value will add to the overall wealth a PC has, but I don't know how much impact it will have.

My understanding is that the 46 would put her at Very Wealthy - then the other stuff is how we work out how many WPs in to that Tier she is.